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Teachers Over 60 No Longer Welcome in China

From: Australia Queensland Brisbane @Barry1 Time : 2017-06-22 16:14:08
Regrettably, starting this year (2017), the Chinese bureaucracy in their infinite "wisdom" have suddenly and unexpectedly banned all foreign English teachers over 60 from working in China.

This is despite them having an acute shortage of teachers from native English speaking countries.

It is also despite a lot of senior Chinese bureaucrats and politicians being well over this age.

This new rule will affect HUNDREDS of expats from many different countries who are over 60 from working there, even if they've lived there for many years - remember for example, our friend @WarmLifeGz  -  who had lived and worked in Guangzhou for many years.   The alarm, disappointment and disruption this rule will have on many good hearted, older teachers in China shouldn't be underestimated. 

Even if they marry a Chinese citizen, this still doesn't allow them to work. They need a work permit, but they won't be able to get one, if over 60.

In a nutshell, China welcomes say, a 20 year old teaching graduate with nil teaching experience.  But a highly experienced veteran with forty years experience under his belt is automatically excluded.

I used to think the Chinese were smart.  Now I'm not so sure.  

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From: China 浙江(zhe jiang) 杭州(hang zhou ) @JohnAbbot Time : 2017-06-23 13:30:15 #1

I asked Barry after he posted this thread the question:

Regarding the China regulation change to 60 years, are you 100% certain it is a national ruling and not a provincial one?

He responded as follows: 

Regarding the change to the foreign teacher age regulations, I’m as sure as I can be without being abler to cite or quote the official government gazette.  Reasons are as follows:

1.  The university in Sichuan told me that last year I was able to work there but this year I was not, due to a change in regulation.  The Chinese foreign teacher manager there is experienced;  he likes me;  he said he did his best but ran into a brick wall.

2.  I then contacted Horizon, a large Chinese teacher recruiting company.  They had about 20 university teacher jobs available spread out all over the country.  I asked if I was able to work in ANY of these jobs.  The answer was no.

3.  I then contacted three other Chinese teacher recruiters in different provinces.  They all said the same thing.

4.  A representative from Panda Education (http://www.panda-education.ca/)  confirmed the above new rule in a posting on one of the teacher blogs that I subscribe to.

I consider that answer to be more than enough background to make this news very real and very important for anyone 60 or older and planning to teach English in China to rethink that plan. If offered a teaching job in China and you're over the age of 59, you should double or triple check with the school offering the job if they are 100% certain they can employ you. 

This is doubly so if you're not already living in China. Imagine how devastating it might be if you give up your current situation back home, only to arrive in China to find out the teaching job you thought was waiting for you had fallen through.

For those of you with knowledge of this matter, we'd love to hear from you. Please comment below.

From: Australia Queensland Brisbane @Barry1 Time : 2017-06-23 15:02:23 #2


@JohnAbbot

 

By way of further information, a teacher recruiting company based in Chengdu offered me a job on the following basis:

1.  That I enter the country on a normal tourist visa. They then will convert this to an S visa that instead of lasting for the normal twelve months, only is valid for three months.

 

2.  But under the rues of an S visa, one is NOT supposed to be a full time paid worker.

 

3.  The recruiter then said I should fly to Hong Kong every three months, in order to refresh the S visa, then fly back to Chengdu.

 

4.  The above arrangement isn't legal but in a discussion with the recruiter, she said many older foreigners were doing this.  If they get caught however, a substantial fine plus an automatic expulsion from the country would likely be the result.

 

So some teacher recruiters in China are trying to circumvent the harsh new age rule, but at GREAT RISK to the hapless foreign teachers.  I'm sure the Chinese immigration authorities would soon sniff a rat in cases like this also. They're not idiots.  Questions may be asked at the border, why the teacher keeps returning.

 

Why the teacher recruiters are doing this of course, is because they earn money from every teacher that they can recruit.  They're not doing it simply because they're all kind hearted!

 

Prospective older teachers in China  - be warned.  Don't be lured into the country illegally by some smooth talking teacher recruiter.  :^)

From: China 江苏(jiang su) 扬州(yang zhou ) @paulfox1 Time : 2017-06-26 09:39:46 #3

What Barry is saying here is, sadly, 100% true.

Male Chinese nationals have the opportunity to retire at 55. They can, of course, continue to age 60, but then, it seems that retirement is mandatory.

Therefore, the Chinese gov appear to be adopting the approach that if Chinese men over 60 cannot be employed, how can they go on to justify employing foreigners over 60.

On paper, this makes sense and I can see where they are coming from. However, they are clearly not taking Barry's main point into account insofar as they are shunning years of experience in favour of putting young kids in the classrrom.

Most Chinese parents, that I have spoken to, would much rather have their kids taught by an older, more experienced teacher, than a 20-something year old.

From: China 辽宁(liao ning) 沈阳(shen yang ) @AchrisT Time : 2017-06-28 21:36:38 #4

Well I know there has always been an age discrimination when it comes to teaching here. In the past four years here I have been turned down by many schools who wanted a 21-year-old and not someone over 45. So, to hear that I am not surprise.  I have a friend who works at China Medical University, he is 63, he understands that he can continue to 65. But as he said he wouldn’t be surprise that when he goes through the procedure again that they could say “sorry”.   But the age thing has always been there, I just gave up applying for the schools and stayed with the language centers.

 The new laws are making it harder to get the expert certificate. The new laws are making it difficult to include certain things. There are now three levels of a work visa

The major thing is getting a certified Diploma, that has a lot of teachers leaving. I for one am leaving at the end of this contract, but I squeaked through the week before the new laws came into effect.  The last time I was stateside I call the University and asked about certifying the diploma and at a cost, they were happy to. This cost is ranging from different people I have talked to is between 100 and 1000 Dollars. A teacher, I worked with last year, was from the Island of Jersey. He stated that the certifying process gave him a large problem and prevented him from getting the initial 30-day visa to come over. The Chinese embassy wouldn’t allow him to apply for the visa till he had a certified diploma.

The other thing is the language test. I copied this from the net.

“The new HSK is an international standardized exam that tests and rates Chinese language proficiency. It assesses non-native Chinese speakers’ abilities in using the Chinese language in their daily, academic and professional lives. HSK consists of six levels, namely the HSK (level I), HSK (level II), HSK (level III), HSK (level IV), HSK (level V), and HSK (level VI).”

I understand if you pass the first to third levels you are eligible for the lower tier visa, The passing of the any of the levels gets you the next highest level and the third level is for those that have investments in China.

John brings up a point that I never considered and if this is regulated by the providence or Beijing. I had always assumed Beijing was behind this, but now am not sure.

The fact still remains that my age has always been a problem with the State and private schools. The language centers will take you and treat you as a slave to their whims.  The new laws are making it harder for all od the foreign teachers. All the same, there are many countries out there that are hiring and It is just easier to go find a new home.

From: China 辽宁(liao ning) 沈阳(shen yang ) @AchrisT Time : 2017-06-28 21:43:16 #5

@Barry1, I know of the procedure, first I wouldn't give the power to anyone to have a control of my life.  If caught, the fines are a large amount, students can get up to a million Yuan fine, for teaching on a student visa. I would assume it would be in that area also.

Second thing is you are violating a Visa, that if goes worldwide might limit your chases of getting a visa elsewhere.

 

 

 

Anonymous25874
@Anonymous25874 Time : 2017-06-29 01:39:21 #6

In my several trips to China I have been offered to teach English to kids many times, the people offering are not concerned that I am not a qualified teacher, they want to pay cash for each lesson "under the table" I have never been approached by any form of recruiting company on the level but more than a few times I have been approached and asked to teach "under" the table by these firms....

I personally will not do this as it jeapodizes my ability to come to China to see my woman, which to me is the most important thing to me. 

Sad to see the Chinese Government is shooting the hand that feeds it, do they not realize that most of the teachers can earn alot more in their own countries and most take positions in China not to get rich but to learn another culutre. What will this age bias do to the level of English insturuction available? Most younger teachers in China are single men, are there to meet women, socialize, teach and get paid for it. The older teachers are mostly single as well but are not neccessarily out playing the field...

 

And I could be wrong about it as well....

From: Australia Queensland Brisbane @Barry1 Time : 2017-06-29 17:42:51 #7


@AchrisT

@Anonymous25874

 

Thanks for your comments, gentlemen.

 

The new age laws are a particular disappointment to me as I had planned to return to China for another year or two of teaching, beginning this September.  A major life commitment that suddenly was stolen from me.

 

I should say also that people aged 59 may be affected also, as the age rule applies to the oldest age that a person will be in any given year.  Let me explain.  If you have a birthday on say, 31 December, reaching age 60 from age 59, just for one day of the year, as far as China is concerned, you're classified as a 60 year old for the whole year.  So many 59 year olds will be caught in this age discrimination net as well.

 

I investigated teaching in both Vietnam and Thailand, but the age discrimation was even worse than China.  Anyone over 50 will have difficulty securing a teacher position in either country.

 

Anyway, as they say, as one door closes, another one will open.   But where will it lead to?  :^)

 

 

 


 

From: China 江苏(jiang su) 南京(nan jing ) @spiderboenz Time : 2017-07-17 13:33:30 #8
Technically, this law has been on the books for quite some time. They are starting to enforce it, that's all.
From: Australia Queensland Brisbane @Barry1 Time : 2017-07-17 16:01:47 #9


@spiderboenz

 

Thanks for the info.

With the enforcement of this law, the shortage of native English speaking teachers in China is worse than ever before.

 

It's hard to fathom why a highly experienced teacher that the school or university would love to stay on, is summarily excluded because the magic age of 59/60 is reached.  As I said elsewhere, if you're 59 and your birthday is on the last day of the year, as far as Chinese authorities go, they count you as a 60 year old for the entire year.  So many people aged 59 will be caught in this crackdown as well.

 

Cheers mate.  (beer)

Anonymous25896
@Anonymous25896 Time : 2017-07-18 06:02:52 #10

@Barry1 "Anyway, as they say, as one door closes, another one will open.   But where will it lead to? "

Maybe to Vietnam to laze away your days on the beach with a good book in hand (sun)?

We can wish can't we?

From: China 江苏(jiang su) 南京(nan jing ) @spiderboenz Time : 2017-07-18 14:39:01 #11

 

@Barry1it's not just the age thing that is driving the teacher shortage. Have to have an original, notarized, authenticated copy of your degree, letters of recommendation from at least 2 former (related to teaching) employers, notarized criminal background check, and authenticated TESLOL/TEFL certification.  All items need to be authenticated at the Chinese consulate in the country where it was issued. All items must be translated into Chinese by an official translation company, complete with officials stamp.  If you're American, then the degree has to first be authenticated by the State Department in the state where the school is located.  

It is a hassle.

 

 

 

From: Australia Queensland Brisbane @Barry1 Time : 2017-07-18 15:10:14 #12


@Anonymous25896

"Maybe to Vietnam to laze away your days on the beach with a good book in hand

We can wish can't we?"



Thanks for the good idea, buddy.

But yet one part of me says isn't there more to life than lazing away?

But then again, this is indeed the cherished dream of many.

 

It raises the question - what is the meaning and purpose in life?

To work digently?

Or to sit under a coconut tree? 

 

Or is there no purpose? (think)



 

Anonymous25901
@Anonymous25901 Time : 2017-07-19 22:53:13 #13

ahhh Barry, from what better vantage point to partake of a cold frosty pop and eye the beautiful living scenery? Perhaps finding that rose without the thorns? All while smiling at the rat race and reading that good book you've always wanted to read but never "gave" yourself the time to read it.

The chances of this scenario happening in China is very slim, maybe in the southeast of China...

Can you achieve your wants and needs in Australia? If where you live is all like where I live your more likely to find a bunch of fat, obese, smelly, angry, tatted up feminists wanting to cut your balls off and burn you at the stake...tell me I am wrong.

Cheers mate!

From: Australia Queensland Brisbane @Barry1 Time : 2017-07-21 05:48:00 #14


@Anonymous25901

 

" from what better vantage point to partake of a cold frosty pop and eye the beautiful living scenery?.......If where you live is all like where I live your more likely to find a bunch of fat, obese, smelly, angry, tatted up feminists wanting to cut your balls off and burn you at the stake"

 

I must admit you present a very cogent argument.  I think also that you must live where I live also!

 

I'm considering checking out the Chinag mai region in northern Thailand, though what @paulfox1 has been saying lately, Thailand has turned a bit unfriendly towards Westerners, compared to how it was a few years ago. Maybe because of the military intervention?  He says Vietnam is better now.

 

I must say also there are so many books I'd like to read but you're spot on the money when you say that time is the limiting factor. 

 

Who knows what the future will hold?  Certainly not me.

 

Cheers buddy.  (beer)(y)

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