By
John Abbot
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2/5/2012 4:21:17 PM
We’ve had an interesting little run in with a Scammer over the last few days so I thought you all might be interested in it. It’s been quiet on the scammer front for the last few months, and while a few have been caught and placed in Scammer Prison, it has mostly been online Chinese Dating as usual here on CLM. But this one is a little unique so maybe it's worth the write up.
This fellow, whose profile photo I am posting here because much of the story revolves around his photo, went by the username “lplove” and said about himself in his profile that he is a citizen of the USA who lives in the USA. In his email registered on CLM he used the name “lpanch” and in numerous messages and chats he goes by “luis panch”.
We received a report from a lady member that he had asked her for money, and that his story matched very clearly one of the typical scammer scenarios of the many we have published in our Chinese version of "About Scammers” on the Chinese site. Here is a portion of the message she had received from him which led to her reporting him:
“Thank you so much for your message, am so happy the meeting was going so successful my next trip will be flying to china to meet with you after i received the money from Bank Negara Malaysia, i want to buy a house in china, open up a big venture enterprise, give you a good love and good life.
As the day fades away and slips into night, I find myself dreaming about you praying . Every night I pray to God that he will keep (you) in his arms. I pray that he keeps you out of harm's way until we can finally be together in china soon after I receive the money from the Malaysian Bank. My dear please help i don't have much money now to pay for my hotel bills kindly help me with some money as soon as possible am waiting thank you.”
Just as we were initiating our investigation of lplove, already 99% sure he was a Scammer, he terminated his own membership and wrote in his reason for cancelling that “i am relocating back the United kingdom”.
Well that sounded like bullshit on a couple of levels:
1. CLM is available everywhere in the world, so why would you quit because you are moving from one country to another? It just doesn’t make much sense.
2. How does an American living in America “relocate BACK to the United Kingdom”? That makes zero sense.
So now our bullshit antennas were buzzing like crazy.
After digging deeper, in spite of the fact that he’s been using an associate in the USA to log in to the website, we found evidence that he was actually located in Malaysia. Bingo – that was enough to confirm he was a liar and we accepted the report. Into Scammer Prison he went and out went the notices to all the Chinese and Asian ladies he had ever had any contact with.
We started receiving letters from a number of Chinese women members confirming that lplove was scamming them as well and thanking us for warning them.
So far this is just another Scammer story, nothing special. But here’s where it steered off course into the realm of the unusual.
We received a message through our “Contact Us” page from lplove saying:
“i saw my picture here on the prison list please kindly remove it as soon as possible i am not a scammer!!! i am the original person thank you for your kind co-operation
Petter Kelly”
Attached to that message were 5 photos of the same person who is shown on lplove’s profile on CLM. So this tells us that lplove may actually be the person in the profile photo OR that he has stolen a number of photos of the innocent person whose picture is on lplove’s profile. We still know he’s a Scammer, regardless of whose photo it is.
We responded in an email to that message as follows:
“Unfortunately we have no way of knowing if what you are saying is true or not. We'll be happy to consider your request after we've had a video chat with you to confirm you are the person in the photos you're providing and that are posted on your profile.
Please advise of a date and time when you can be ready to chat with us and we'll arrange to turn your membership back on in order to have a brief video chat. Someone can be available between 10 AM and 10 PM China time most days of the week. We'll await your advice.”
Before he had received our response we got a second message on our “Contact Us” page saying:
"Hello i am Mr Petter i send you an email about 2hour ago requesting that my picture should me removed from your prison scammer list am innocent please thank you am waiting Mr Petter some one is making you use of my pictures i have already send you 5pics of my as you demand”
This message is interesting because he was “Petter Kelly” in the first message but he is “Mr. Petter” in the second message, so he seems to be confused about whether “Petter” is his given name or his family name. It is also interesting because he indicates that he has enclosed “5 pics of my as you demand” but we have never demanded any such thing.
Shortly after that we received an email response to our email saying this:
“DEAR WHAT I AM TELLING YOU IS THIS... SOME ONE USE MY PICTURES FOR FAKES OPERATIONS ON CLM, KINDLY REMOVE MY PICTURES I AM INNOCENT THANK YOU I HOPE MY REQUEST WILL BE GRANTED
PETER”
The capital letters are his, shouting at us presumably. And now he is suddenly “Peter”, not “Petter”.
We shouted back:
“WHAT WE ARE TELLING YOU IS WE DON'T BELIEVE YOU!!! NO VIDEO CHAT = NO PHOTO REMOVAL. EVEN THEN YOU'LL HAVE SOME SERIOUS QUESTIONS TO ANSWER BEFORE WE'LL AGREE TO REMOVE THE PHOTOS.”
We have not had any reply to this last message but we have received a report from another member indicating that lplove is trying to persuade her that he was deleted by us by mistake, that he threatened to sue us in Hong Kong and that we have officially apologized in a letter to him. She sent a copy of a chat she had with him.
It read as follows:
"luis.panch: hi
luis.panch: is been so long
luis.panch: hope ur good
luis.panch: i think ur busy byee we chart later
CLM member: I was told that you have been put into net prison.
CLM member: You told the lie
CLM member: You have told lie to many ladies. You have hurt lots of person. I hate your acting.hate hate hate..........
luis.panch: hmm
luis.panch: pls dont think so
luis.panch: i never cheat any one
luis.panch: or hurt anyone
luis.panch: am innocent
luis.panch: the CLM administrator was speaking with my lawyer today on phone from hong-kong
luis.panch: i want to sue clm to court
luis.panch: they write me official later of apology
luis.panch: i am not telling you to beleive me ok
luis.panch: but dont judge me am innocent
CLM member: ok,can you send me phone numer of your home and the university ?
luis.panch: CLM said it was a data base error from the official website
luis.panch: if you dont believe me is ok
CLM member: OK, I can wait till I get the correct news
luis.panch: i am not interested in CLM anymore
luis.panch: when i come to china i will find a chinese woman on my own
luis.panch: i dont engage myself in any dating web site since my life
CLM member: IF you want me to trust you give me your really name and your student ID. i can ask my friend in USA to help me to check up .
luis.panch: this is the first time cos i have love and intrest for chinese people
luis.panch: i am not in the USA NOW
luis.panch: i told you
CLM member: WHY DID NOT ANSWER MY question?
luis.panch: which questions
CLM member: Where are you?
luis.panch: am in england
CLM member: ok,give me your phone numer. I try to call you.
luis.panch: +447031999289
CLM member: Where did you live? And the adrees you work? I also have friend in uk. I will ask them to go and visit you.
luis.panch: pls dont bother urself i know u cant beleive me
luis.panch: if you can come here on your own fine
luis.panch: but am not willing to meet"
Now I ask you – does our last message to lplove sound like an “official later of apology”?
If we had been in contact with lplove’s lawyers in Hong Kong and had admitted we made a mistake would his sorry ass still be sitting and rotting away in Scammer Prison?
Check here...
We don’t expect to hear from lplove again but if we do we’ll update you here.
The moral of the story is that these idiots never stop lying and they never give up trying to cheat people. As usual, don’t trust anyone you have not had a video chat with and don’t send money to anyone you haven’t met in person and developed a relationship with that can be grounded in trust.
Where have you heard that before?
Copyright owned jointly by Author and CyberCupid Co., Ltd. Breach of copyright will
be prosecuted.
I have become an expert at detecting Russian & Ukraine scammers and there is a "technique" I developed to at least know [almost 100%], who is doing the emailing. I simply and politely, ask for a photo of them holding up a sign with my name on it [DENNIS]. I've actually received about 4 of those photos and almost all of the others, I never here from again.
Anyway, the video request you asked for is best way to screen, especially if the guy is American and should be able to afford a video cam.
Thanks again
As for the video chat, I personally would never accept the excuse that they can't video chat for any reason, especially the reason that they can't afford it. If they can't go find a computer in an internet cafe, or that of a friend, that they can have a quick video chat on, then there's no reason to take things any further. You can be 99% sure that they're lying. There is no sense in bucking those odds if you ask me.
I like your idea of the picture holding your name up, but as you say, the video chat is the best way to screen.
Very interesting this story! Tks for deffending us and the site from those Scams!
Keep on with your good work....
tks,
tabuedificil
Hi JaneDai - your "friend", Luis Panch, is sitting in Scammer Prison now, where he belongs, and you should go make this same comment there so others can learn from it.
I think most young male and female (18 to 25) is not a scammer, it's that true? Coz I met a young lady in CLM , and somehow I feel more attached.
Excellent work, John. Called him on his bullshit and he folded.
Hi, John,
How are you?
You are so kind, so I know you will not be angry that I thought you was tanshui . Sure, from your words "but you should be careful not to pass up what may be the best match you could have made simply because you misunderstood the cultural demands and stresses that she is being influenced by. ”
Yes, you are right. I was used to be misunderstood by Westerners. For example, a guy( referred to as D)who was going to visit me in Beijing, but I was not in Beijing then, so he thought that I was cheating on him advisedly. God, no matter what I tried my best to explain or to express myself, he called me a liar. I am innocent really, and my tears flow. Sometimes, I was online really, but I was hosting a client or more from my legal cases, then D would say " I have been ignored, certainly you are chatting with other men. Why are you still on the line when I do not online?" I have been feeling guilty, but suddenly I wanted to try his words were true or not. So, I used a photo of my niece registration (referred to as the "niece") did not take the initiative to speak but just to browse his online. You know, he immediately replied to niece the same words like " Wow, you are really beautiful, and my yahoo and skype are xxxxx". "Niece" asked him: " Do you talk to other girls on this site before?" D answered: " No and never, I like you only. Look, the rest is pretty ugly." Niece asked again: "when did you register?" D replied: " About one hour ago, I am so lucky to talk to you for the first time ( Note: I have contacted him more than two weeks)". I know this is only a tiny little bit guys on CLM.
I'm sure almost there is NO Chinese woman to play games online. This is because Chinese government is almost no benefits to their people, including pensions and medical insurance. So the people have to earn their money day and night to buy their own insurance, their food, save their money for their children, their parents and themselves, very miserable, but they thought that it was the same with all of the countries in this world. so they have to survive the crisis, and everyone is busy making money to prevent disease and old from them. In addition, the Chinese women have to more attentions for their children's education and their heart is very urgent. They take almost all their time to find some school paying so much money for their children in ordre to make their children admitted by one of the universities. The reason why they do this what I mentioned above? In order to let their children earn more money in the future. In short, in my divorce law cases, which I have handled more than one hundred as well as the reception of thousands of this kind of case's Legal advices, so I understand that Chinese women worry about their life always and even about their future. They worry about finding someone who will be her new husband and their hearts are urgent. Therefore, except individual women asking for money, the vast majority of Chinese women fit for Westerners, very suitable. I also know a little about Western women from English movie like ME, MYSELF&IRENE and from men's telling me online. When some of them have an affair, they will dropped their husbands, their children and ran away from them. This is almost impossible in China, because the vast majority of Chinese women have never heard from such a thing happened. Both Traditions and Customs in China are very important.